Yahoo Forum Archive

I'd like to suggest a new category: poetry.

I'm not sure if you want to split it up, but I'd really like to see a
poetry-specific category. Really, I'd like to see this split into two
categories: high and low. High would be a piece dealing with a great
event, the kind you record in history; low would be those events that
are more everyday. The difference between, say, Legolas singing about
Luthien Tinuviel and Pippin singing about how Will Whitfoot's song fell
all around him. But I'm not sure how to formalise that distinction.

Cheers,
Marta

--- In MEFAwards@yahoogroups.com, Marta <MartaL0712@n...> wrote:

> I'd like to suggest a new category: poetry.
>

Urk. My apologies, guys. I just read on the Q&A at the website that
Poetry was allowed but wasn't it's own category. Maybe we should
consider adding this as a subcategory to the genres category? We could
have:

1. The Tom Bombadil Award
2. The Hall of Fire Award
3. The Bilbo Baggins Award

Just a thought.

Cheers, Marta

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marta [mailto:MartaL0712@netscape.net]
> Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2004 7:51 PM
> To: MEFAwards@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [MEFAwards] Request for new story
>
> I'd like to suggest a new category: poetry.
>
> I'm not sure if you want to split it up, but I'd really like
> to see a poetry-specific category. Really, I'd like to see
> this split into two
> categories: high and low. High would be a piece dealing with
> a great event, the kind you record in history; low would be
> those events that are more everyday. The difference between,
> say, Legolas singing about Luthien Tinuviel and Pippin
> singing about how Will Whitfoot's song fell all around him.
> But I'm not sure how to formalise that distinction.

Well, I had set a limit on this for before Nomination Season actually began.
I wanted the category lists and Awards titles settled by then.

I always saw Poetry as a subcategory. Such as Elves\Poetry, or
Hobbits\Poetry, or LOTR\Poetry.

As for two categories, definitely out of the question. IF there were to be
a Poetry category, "high" and "low" could be subcategories.

Why do I resist another category? It's not because I think less of Poetry.
But because I've already been accused of having too many. And because we'd
need to think of three appropriate Awards Titles for that category (and
poetry, to me, just doesn't seem to do that very well, but I could be
wrong.). And because I'm still trying to get artists to join up and make
award banners for those Award Titles. So far, I'm the only one I know of
who has made any, and I'm not that talented! I won't be able to do anything
not filmed by Peter Jackson.

That said, if a majority of the members (as of today, May 1) want Poetry as
a main category, I'll grant it, but you guys really have to help me find the
artists for this. And more of you need to volunteer to count the votes when
time comes. As I write this, we have 46 members. Thus you'd need 24 Yes
votes from existing members (I can see when members joined on the Yahoo
site). I'll throw up a poll, only after you've come up with three
appropriate potential Awards Titles and remember they should be something
that might lend itself to a banner graphic.

Now that Nomination Season has started, I'm going to set the bar very high
for adding any more categories. The bar will lower again after this years
Awards Seasons are over and we set about revising things that worked or
didn't for next year.

--Ainaechoiriel

"This evil cannot be concealed by the power of the Elves," Elrond said, "for
it is Windows-compatible, and freeware at that." --H.F.

http://www.stormpages.com/gabrielle/lotr Land of Myth and Memory
Blog: http://www.ainaechoiriel.blogspot.com

You beat me to the next post. Still read my other. You've got the three
names, so I'll make a poll.

24 yes votes from existing members.

And I want promises to go and recruit artists. No joking.

--Ainaechoiriel

"This evil cannot be concealed by the power of the Elves," Elrond said, "for
it is Windows-compatible, and freeware at that." --H.F.

http://www.stormpages.com/gabrielle/lotr Land of Myth and Memory
Blog: http://www.ainaechoiriel.blogspot.com

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marta [mailto:MartaL0712@netscape.net]
> Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2004 8:05 PM
> To: MEFAwards@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [MEFAwards] Re: Request for new story
>
> --- In MEFAwards@yahoogroups.com, Marta <MartaL0712@n...> wrote:
> > I'd like to suggest a new category: poetry.
> >
>
> Urk. My apologies, guys. I just read on the Q&A at the
> website that Poetry was allowed but wasn't it's own category.
> Maybe we should consider adding this as a subcategory to the
> genres category? We could
> have:
>
> 1. The Tom Bombadil Award
> 2. The Hall of Fire Award
> 3. The Bilbo Baggins Award
>
> Just a thought.
>
> Cheers, Marta
>
>
>
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> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marta [mailto:MartaL0712@netscape.net]
> Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2004 8:05 PM
> To: MEFAwards@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [MEFAwards] Re: Request for new story

> 1. The Tom Bombadil Award
> 2. The Hall of Fire Award
> 3. The Bilbo Baggins Award

Oops. Forgot. You don't have your three awards titles. In the beginning I
had one title that was duplicated, but it was replaced. There are now no
duplicate Awards titles. There are already titles for Tom Bombadil and
Bilbo Baggins. The Hall of Fire Award sounds good though.

--Ainaechoiriel

"This evil cannot be concealed by the power of the Elves," Elrond said, "for
it is Windows-compatible, and freeware at that." --H.F.

http://www.stormpages.com/gabrielle/lotr Land of Myth and Memory
Blog: http://www.ainaechoiriel.blogspot.com

> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Marta [mailto:MartaL0712@n...]
> > Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2004 8:05 PM
> > To: MEFAwards@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [MEFAwards] Re: Request for new story
>
> > 1. The Tom Bombadil Award
> > 2. The Hall of Fire Award
> > 3. The Bilbo Baggins Award
>
> Oops. Forgot. You don't have your three awards titles. In the

beginning I

> had one title that was duplicated, but it was replaced. There are

now no

> duplicate Awards titles.

That was my fault; I should have read the rules more carefully. And
also, my apologies for not realising nominations had started when I
proposed this category.

If it flies -- and I'll understand if it doesn't -- here are some
proposed titles:

1. The Hall of Fire Awards
2. The Caras Galadhon Awards
3. The Prancing Pony Awards

or, even better:

1. Hey dol! merry dol! Awards
2. Tra-la-la-lally Awards
3. Ash Nazg Gimbatul Awards

or if you think people might object to winning an award titled in
Black Speech, how about the "Elbereth Gilthoniel" Awards?

By the way, Ainae, I am pretty artistically motivated, if not
talented, and I would be glad to try my hand at making banners. I have
never done it, but am quick at learning computer things. If anyone
would be willing to teach me, I would be willing to help making banners.

Cheers,
Marta

> award banners for those Award Titles. So far, I'm the only one I

know of

> who has made any, and I'm not that talented! I won't be able to do

anything

> not filmed by Peter Jackson.

I'm working on a couple of idea's for banners, just hang in there it
might take about a week to get them presentable.

>
> Now that Nomination Season has started, I'm going to set the bar

very high

> for adding any more categories.

You might want to seriously think about wanting to add more
categories now that nominations have started. I see the potential
for it getting to be something that could add way too much stress to
your life. Maybe you should just take suggestions and file them in a
database to consider for next year as you said. Just a thought, this
should be fun for you as well.


Stella

> > Now that Nomination Season has started, I'm going to set the bar
> very high
> > for adding any more categories.
>
> You might want to seriously think about wanting to add more
> categories now that nominations have started. I see the potential
> for it getting to be something that could add way too much stress to
> your life. Maybe you should just take suggestions and file them in a
> database to consider for next year as you said. Just a thought, this
> should be fun for you as well.

I agree. Ainae, if you don't want to do this, I'll entirely
understand. Like I said, it was my fault for forgetting nominations
started today. If it will cause you additional stress, then I say
don't make the new category.

Just so I'm clear -- by "Category," do you mean "Genre," "Race," or
"Time"? Or do you mean one of the sublistings under that. I.e., is
Elves a subcategory under "Races," or is "Races -- Elves" one category?

I can see poetry being a subcategory of say, Elves or LotR, but I have
a much harder time seing it as a subcategory of Drama, or romance, or
whatever. It seems a much more natural division (to me, at least) to
say Genre -- Poetry than Genre -- Drama -- Poetry, because I think the
latter will just divide too far.

However, as it is my mistake for not getting this on time, I will
defer to whatever you say. I'm very sorry to up your stress level; not
my intention, I assure you.

Cheers, Marta

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marta [mailto:MartaL0712@netscape.net]
> Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2004 9:26 PM
> To: MEFAwards@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [MEFAwards] Re: Request for new story
>
> I agree. Ainae, if you don't want to do this, I'll entirely
> understand. Like I said, it was my fault for forgetting
> nominations started today. If it will cause you additional
> stress, then I say don't make the new category.

Thank you for the concern. So far, I can honestly say this is nowhere near
the GigaStress or even the MegaStress. Still, I had to read your message
twice to understand it. Sadly, the effects of stress may linger long after
the stress has let up. I feel like someday I'm going to be travelling the
country giving seminars to people warning about the dangers of stress.

> Just so I'm clear -- by "Category," do you mean "Genre,"
> "Race," or "Time"? Or do you mean one of the sublistings
> under that. I.e., is Elves a subcategory under "Races," or is
> "Races -- Elves" one category?

I realize that those divisions (Races and Places, Genres, and Time/Book)
have confused several people who read them as being a category. Maybe I'll
revise the FAQ to call them "Divisions" or "Topics". They are not the main
categories. "Elves, Men, Hobbits, Orcs, Numenor, Rohan, Drama, Humor,
Horror, Romance, Adventure, etc." those are the main categories.

> I can see poetry being a subcategory of say, Elves or LotR,
> but I have a much harder time seing it as a subcategory of
> Drama, or romance, or whatever. It seems a much more natural
> division (to me, at least) to say Genre -- Poetry than Genre
> -- Drama -- Poetry, because I think the latter will just
> divide too far.

Yes, I think we're seeing things on the same level now. I see it as a
subcategory of Elves, or Men, or Hobbits, or even LOTR, The Silm, or The
Hobbit. Or Humor. I had to put Dwim's The Hamster down as Humor, but it's
definitely a poem and that's the subcategory to me. It's hilarious first.
Poem is the form it takes.

> However, as it is my mistake for not getting this on time, I
> will defer to whatever you say. I'm very sorry to up your
> stress level; not my intention, I assure you.

Thank you and not a problem. Let's call a moritorem (I can't spell all that
well anymore either) on new categories, as I had originally planned when I
told the Orc and Mystery people that they had to be Ok'd as new categories
before Nomination Season started. They did and there they are.

If it doesn't work out as a subcategory this year, make a plea for it after
this year's awards are done. It may then make the line up for next year. I
made up the way a new category goes in by the seat of my pants for Orc and
Mystery. They did seem to have a good claim to the need. As Sorne/Enros if
she doesn't write orc stories. I think we should--after this awards year is
over--decide on a documented procedure for the adding of a category.

And I would love for you to try your hand at the banners. The way I've done
them hasn't been hard. Complicated perhaps, but probably more
computer-graphic-friendly people could do it less complicatedly. I basically
took pics I had saved on my hard drive and cropped them into a rectangle
that looked about right. Or I spliced a few together. For example, with my
Aragorn and Arwen one, I had two pics scanned from one of the soundtracks.
I reduced them and didn't crop really. They stayed squares and I just placed
them side by side in PowerPoint. Then I used the TextBox tool to put the
words on, saved the slide as a jpeg and then opened it in a photo editor to
crop out all the white around the banner. I spliced most of the Rohan ones
together, too. But some, like the argonath one is just a rectangle crop from
an existing pic.

Which is why I won't be able to do anything Peter Jackson didn't film.
We'll need some actual artists for that, I think. ;-)

--Ainaechoiriel

"This evil cannot be concealed by the power of the Elves," Elrond said, "for
it is Windows-compatible, and freeware at that." --H.F.

http://www.stormpages.com/gabrielle/lotr Land of Myth and Memory
Blog: http://www.ainaechoiriel.blogspot.com

>>I agree. Ainae, if you don't want to do this, I'll entirely
>>understand. Like I said, it was my fault for forgetting
>>nominations started today. If it will cause you additional
>>stress, then I say don't make the new category.

>Thank you for the concern. So far, I can honestly say this is nowhere near
>the GigaStress or even the MegaStress. Still, I had to read your message
>twice to understand it. Sadly, the effects of stress may linger long after
>the stress has let up. I feel like someday I'm going to be travelling the
>country giving seminars to people warning about the dangers of stress.

Sorry to hear about GigaStress. I am currently heading into finals week
but have learned that if I take half an hour or an hour to bust the
stress I'll get more done for missing that study time. I've vowed to
myself not to get stressed out, and so I'm all for doing whatever I can
to help other people avoid it.

>>Just so I'm clear -- by "Category," do you mean "Genre,"
>>"Race," or "Time"? Or do you mean one of the sublistings
>>under that. I.e., is Elves a subcategory under "Races," or is
>>"Races -- Elves" one category?

>I realize that those divisions (Races and Places, Genres, and Time/Book)
>have confused several people who read them as being a category. Maybe I'll
>revise the FAQ to call them "Divisions" or "Topics". They are not the main
>categories. "Elves, Men, Hobbits, Orcs, Numenor, Rohan, Drama, Humor,
>Horror, Romance, Adventure, etc." those are the main categories.

OK, I see what you mean.

>>I can see poetry being a subcategory of say, Elves or LotR,
>>but I have a much harder time seing it as a subcategory of
>>Drama, or romance, or whatever. It seems a much more natural
>>division (to me, at least) to say Genre -- Poetry than Genre
>>-- Drama -- Poetry, because I think the latter will just
>>divide too far.

>Yes, I think we're seeing things on the same level now. I see it as a
>subcategory of Elves, or Men, or Hobbits, or even LOTR, The Silm, or The
>Hobbit. Or Humor. I had to put Dwim's The Hamster down as Humor, but it's
>definitely a poem and that's the subcategory to me. It's hilarious first.
>Poem is the form it takes.

I agree with you re: "The Hamster." I reread that last night, and was
chuckling to myself all the way through. It's definitely humour, though
I think it's also poetry (it seems to deserve special recognition for
keeping to the form so well.)

But there are other categories where I think this would work less well.
Drama, for instance, or romance -- I have a hard time seeing poems
competing on equal footing with stories just because they're so
different. That, however, is something I will ring up when the awards
are over, for next year.

You say you see poetry as a subcategory. Let me ask one last question
(and sorry for being so boneheaded! I don't know why I'm having a hard
time wrapping my heads around the rules, I'm usually not this thick).
You say in the FAQ, VII.B: "Subcategories will use the same awards as
their main default category." Let's say we manage to get five poems by
two authors nominated for, say, Hobbits. Does this mean that you'd form
a subcategory "Hobbits -- Poetry" and that all poetry entered into the
Hobbits category would compete against each other? And would this make
them not compete against other hobbit works (be pulled out of the main
hobbits category into their own private subcategory) or compete *both*
against each other in the subcategory and against all hobbit works in
the main category.

Does that make sense?

>>However, as it is my mistake for not getting this on time, I
>>will defer to whatever you say. I'm very sorry to up your
>>stress level; not my intention, I assure you.

>Thank you and not a problem. Let's call a moritorem (I can't spell all

that

>well anymore either) on new categories, as I had originally planned when I
>told the Orc and Mystery people that they had to be Ok'd as new categories
>before Nomination Season started. They did and there they are.
>If it doesn't work out as a subcategory this year, make a plea for it

after

>this year's awards are done. It may then make the line up for next year. I
>made up the way a new category goes in by the seat of my pants for Orc and
>Mystery. They did seem to have a good claim to the need. As Sorne/Enros if
>she doesn't write orc stories. I think we should--after this awards

year is

>over--decide on a documented procedure for the adding of a category.

Fair enough. Consider my plea for a Poetry category officially dropped.
(For this year. :-E)

>And I would love for you to try your hand at the banners. The way I've

done

>them hasn't been hard. Complicated perhaps, but probably more
>computer-graphic-friendly people could do it less complicatedly. I

basically

>took pics I had saved on my hard drive and cropped them into a rectangle
>that looked about right. Or I spliced a few together. For example, with my
>Aragorn and Arwen one, I had two pics scanned from one of the soundtracks.
>I reduced them and didn't crop really. They stayed squares and I just

placed

>them side by side in PowerPoint. Then I used the TextBox tool to put the
>words on, saved the slide as a jpeg and then opened it in a photo

editor to

>crop out all the white around the banner. I spliced most of the Rohan ones
>together, too. But some, like the argonath one is just a rectangle

crop from

>an existing pic.

OK, that doesn't sound *too* bad. I'll try my hand at it after finals.
Are we keeping a list of what's been done, what people have said they're
working on, and what still needs to be done anywhere?

Cheers,
Marta